75mm or Tech for waxless?

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jyw5
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Re: 75mm or Tech for waxless?

Post by jyw5 » Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:48 pm

spopepro wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:57 am
lilcliffy wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:05 am
spopepro wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:46 am
I haven’t yet tried to ski just at pins downhill yet, but soon. I’m about to put AT bindings on some waxless ingstads, F1 race boots, no tts. So I don’t have useful feedback yet.
So- you mean a tech toe- Telemark boot with tech inserts- and no resistance of any kind (i.e. cable, flexor, etc.)?
For downhill skiing?
Yep. My hope (hope...) is that if it’s low angle enough to not need skins then I can skip transitions entirely and just use at pins. If it’s steep, I lock the heels when I rip skins.

Honestly... I have no idea how well this will all work. I know splitboarders who will kind of hack-tele rollers instead of transitioning and that’s the closest I’ve really got. My goals are kind of narrow though... light weight (boots, bindings, skis are under 5kg all together) good flat efficiency, and stability in occasional sections of 40-45deg slopes. I’ll be sure to report when I get some time on it. It might be terrible!
Many people in my area who have ultralight tech boots say that the downhill performance isn't very good...even when locked down. But I think if conditions are icy, a steep descent is definitely easier/more stable on an AT setup vs tele. Also, lightweight skis get thrown around too when there's crud/refrozen junk. When conditions are good, I'm able to blaze down with my FT62+NNN BC+Alfa Quest Core. its the lightest combo I have...I use the Pomoca 60mm or 62mm pro race 2.0 skins with the tip attachments... so basically the transition is as fast as I can rip, roll, and store the skins. (I get some more support if wearing the Alfa Guard boots but with added weight penalty).

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lilcliffy
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Re: 75mm or Tech for waxless?

Post by lilcliffy » Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:02 pm

spopepro wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:57 am
lilcliffy wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:05 am
spopepro wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:46 am
I haven’t yet tried to ski just at pins downhill yet, but soon. I’m about to put AT bindings on some waxless ingstads, F1 race boots, no tts. So I don’t have useful feedback yet.
So- you mean a tech toe- Telemark boot with tech inserts- and no resistance of any kind (i.e. cable, flexor, etc.)?
For downhill skiing?
Yep. My hope (hope...) is that if it’s low angle enough to not need skins then I can skip transitions entirely and just use at pins. If it’s steep, I lock the heels when I rip skins.

Honestly... I have no idea how well this will all work. I know splitboarders who will kind of hack-tele rollers instead of transitioning and that’s the closest I’ve really got. My goals are kind of narrow though... light weight (boots, bindings, skis are under 5kg all together) good flat efficiency, and stability in occasional sections of 40-45deg slopes. I’ll be sure to report when I get some time on it. It might be terrible!
Hmmm...I just don't see how one can effectively downhill ski with a free heel without some binding resistance (I also cannot see how one can effectively/efficiently XC ski without some binding resistance).

From my perspective, the only benefit of zero binding resistance is climbing a steep slope with a skin (i.e. when one is not really skiing).
I can see accepting the inefficiency of XC skiing with no binding resistance when touring-for-turns- but that doesn't make it efficient.

I am interested in what you discover from this ↑. I have had a couple of experiences skiing without the flexor in a NNNBC binding- it was TERRIBLE, especially downhill.
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.





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lowangle al
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Re: 75mm or Tech for waxless?

Post by lowangle al » Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:26 pm

Although I don't use the free pivot for K&G I do believe it is more efficient. In addition to the unrestricted ROM, I felt that I got a better glide due to the lack of resistance from there being no tip pressure on the trailing ski.

I would use it on a long flatish tour where I knew I had to cover a lot of miles. To get the most out of the free pivot I think I need to get used to getting my kick without breaking the boot bellows, but this doesn't feel like xc skiing to me.





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Stephen
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Re: 75mm or Tech for waxless?

Post by Stephen » Tue Apr 13, 2021 2:59 pm

jyw5 wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:48 pm
... so basically the transition is as fast as I can rip, roll, and store the skins.
@jyw5, are you saying you roll your skins?
I saw this suggested as a way to store skins (for the day) and have been doing that.
I think most people would be aghast, thinking that the skin hairs would transfer to the adhesive, but I have not seen that happen.
I used them yesterday, after being rolled up for about a month, and no problem.





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dnt_upton
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Re: 75mm or Tech for waxless?

Post by dnt_upton » Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:28 pm

Well, I'll offer a different perspective -- depending on the objective and terrain, TTS on any Voile BC skis would be fine. For the rolling terrain, you're basically going up/down with only a Dynafit toe connection. I wouldn't ski down anything challenging in that, but for short rolling hills, it'd be fine. And due to a broken cable, I've skied more than rolling hills with just a Dynafit toe connection. It sucks, but is doable.

Once you get to the line that you want to ski, you connect the cable and can ski uber-challenging terrain gracefully, or at least the gear won't be the limiting factor for your gracefulness.

If you're using the Tx boots or modified F1 boots with the TTS binding, it's pretty damn light.

Cheers.





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jyw5
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Re: 75mm or Tech for waxless?

Post by jyw5 » Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:58 am

Stephen wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 2:59 pm
jyw5 wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:48 pm
... so basically the transition is as fast as I can rip, roll, and store the skins.
@jyw5, are you saying you roll your skins?
I saw this suggested as a way to store skins (for the day) and have been doing that.
I think most people would be aghast, thinking that the skin hairs would transfer to the adhesive, but I have not seen that happen.
I used them yesterday, after being rolled up for about a month, and no problem.
I'm sorry for not being clear. with full length pomoca race pro 2 skins with tip attachments...I rip them without removing my skis, I fold them in half glue to glue. then roll them up really fast, then stuff them in my coat pocket or in my backpack. I never allow mohair to be in contact with the adhesive side.

When I get home, I lay them out with adhesive side up on warm tile to dry out. then store them with the skin savers. ...not really necessary with skin savers if using the next day or 2...but definitely if storing longer.

Also, tracking is much improved with skins on when skiing downhill. especially on icy snow where the skis and the tips like to wander side to side.





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