Waxless Skis Icing Bad

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MikeK

Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by MikeK » Tue Jan 05, 2016 2:31 pm

You know I got myself all confused thinking about the days when I used to wax my skis and I realized I wasn't using Swix wax. The Toko colors are different and that's what I was using. Blue was really cold I think? But also there is a blue in the Swix that is maybe a bit below freezing? Like mid 20's to the teens? That's what I was referring to.

Honestly, especially now, the weather can change so quick I wouldn't rely on wax. The past weekend I was reading temps on my car from 28deg on up to 35deg depending on the elevation, location and time of day.

If I put a wax ski back in my quiver it's going to be reserved for when it gets cold enough that any fluctuation and snow water content should be keeping me well in safe territory.

I recall with Toko it was the yellow wax that was comparable to the Violet temp range. That's the one I always hated. I don't think it was any fault of the wax, I think it was just I was flirting with danger in terms of temp range. If I was down in the Red or Blue it was cold enough I didn't have much issue figuring out which one would work.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure water was my issue, it wasn't icing just on the scales but rather starting at the back of the scales and extending onto the glide zone - I just had no idea it could hang on that long and cause so much icing issues.

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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by Woodserson » Tue Jan 05, 2016 8:30 pm

Just so people aren't turned off on Toko... I use Toko grip wax exclusively, it's really good, far simpler system than Swix (I find) and effective. Just throwing that out there. I used it all last year, all temperatures, even weird transitional temps. The yellow takes a bit of experience to figure out how deep you want to layer, over how much of the ski and how much you want to cork it in. (Go easy!) I'm a believer.

Blue Cold
Red Somewhat Cold
Yellow Warmer to 35deg.F. or so.

But yes, I obviously use my non-grip-wax skis when the snow is wet and sloppy. I have used klister, I don't enjoy it. For super-duper cold (0F), Swix Polar. Works as a great glide wax on the woodies, so I'm already good to go!

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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by Woodserson » Tue Jan 05, 2016 8:33 pm

MikeK wrote:
Anyway, I'm pretty sure water was my issue, it wasn't icing just on the scales but rather starting at the back of the scales and extending onto the glide zone - I just had no idea it could hang on that long and cause so much icing issues.
Yes, water and freezing temps are terrible. I have saved many a skier's day by showing up unannounced like a caped crusader with a scraper and a rag. Scrape Scrape, dry dry, paste wax... Never leave home without it.

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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by MikeK » Tue Jan 05, 2016 9:50 pm

Yeah don't fault Toko on my idiocy. It's good stuff. I'd probably use it again although unless I get dangerous and want to flirt with temps in the 30s, I think I'd be OK with two colors of Swix too.

I'm not a racer so waxless doesn't much bother me. I wind up having to wait for my wife every 5 or 10 min anyway... and I doubt she'd go any faster with the wax!

Oh and Woods, seen as how you like hacks... I don't carry a scraper, I just whack the skis with a pole, rub them against trees or even use the metal edge of the other ski. I ALWAYS carry some paste wax. I should carry a chamois though...

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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by Woodserson » Tue Jan 05, 2016 10:37 pm

The chamois I've never done, I just thought of it. I used a bandanna. I think it would work great. That or micro-fiber. Microfiber feels weird, but damn it cleans up screens like nothing else. Finger grease and everything. Maybe a camp towel? Super absorbent?

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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by lilcliffy » Tue Jan 05, 2016 10:50 pm

Maybe I missed this in your first post- do you hot-wax your tips/tails on your waxless skis?

You mentioned that it is icing up clear into the glide zone on the tail...that sounds like you don't have glide wax on your tail?

I carry my tour kit everywhere: grip wax, cork, liquid glide wax (for the scales), scraper, and a small roll of micro-fiber cloth.

I hot-wax the tips/tails of all of my skis; the entire base of my waxable skis. For backcountry skiing I find grip wax penetrates and sticks to hard glide wax just fine.

I use liquid glide wax on the scales of my waxless skis if the snow is crazy sticky.

I use grip wax ahead of the waxless traction zone if I need extra grip.

Klister is awesome stuff for either wet, or old re-frozen snow- but it sucks in the woods- I only use it on my track skis.

Regardless- if your tails are icing and and freezing up- sounds like they are oxidized and may need multiple treatments of hot wax for it to fully penetrate.

The base on the waxless Glitt is extruded as well- which will require multiple and more frequent hot-wax applications than a sintered base.
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MikeK

Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by MikeK » Wed Jan 06, 2016 12:38 pm

Yeah these skis were freshly waxed with hot wax. My wife is using them now, so it's hard for me to say what they went through. Typically if I get in the water, I lift my ski and knock the ice off with my pole right away. She may have got into some and didn't realize it. I'm sure she did earlier, and maybe I just didn't dry them up enough.

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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by Cannatonic » Wed Jan 06, 2016 2:33 pm

I'd switch to Toko just to get the roll-up containers, instead of trying to tear strips off a metal container in the cold with Swix. You don't need all the Swix waxes, you can simplify it - Green, Blue Extra, and Violet Special are enough for most days below freezing.

Last year I hot-waxed the tips & tails of my waxing skis with glide wax, but I want to try waxing the whole ski with Green or Polar and see what happens.
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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by Woodserson » Wed Jan 06, 2016 2:35 pm

Cork in the polar so it shines and is smooth. It'll glide at all temperatures, and grip and glide at the very low ones. On those super-cold days last year I had marginal left-over blue underfoot, just let the polar do the work. It's wonderful, at least on the woodies.

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Re: Waxless Skis Icing Bad

Post by Cannatonic » Wed Jan 06, 2016 2:54 pm

what do you mean woodies - you talkin' wood skis? aren't you supposed to use pine tar?
"All wisdom is to be gained through suffering"
-Will Lange (quoting Inuit chieftan)

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