Vice mounting without jig

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Hewmeans
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Vice mounting without jig

Post by Hewmeans » Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:18 pm

Mounting vices to alpine skiis, what size step drill bit. Best way to determine boot center line on Ski chord center for aggressive skier?

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MSU Alum
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Re: Vice mounting without jig

Post by MSU Alum » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:45 pm

If it's a modern ski, I'd highly recommend boot center over the manufacturer's recommended mounting point. Especially if you are aggressive.

Freeheellife had a good podcast on the subject:



Sorry I can't help on the other questions.
I usually have a shop do the drilling and then install inserts myself.



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phoenix
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Re: Vice mounting without jig

Post by phoenix » Wed Jan 29, 2020 6:11 pm

Skis usually have the recommended drill bit size printed on the top sheet in the mounting area(3.5, 3.6, 4.1 are common).
If not, the general rule is 3.5 or 6 if there's no metal top sheet, 4.1 if there is. Be sure to eyeball the bit along the sidewall of the ski before you drill,to be sure it's not too long! This is assuming you're using a ski mounting bit; if you're planning a regular bit (not recommended!), I dunno.



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fisheater
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Re: Vice mounting without jig

Post by fisheater » Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:00 pm

I use fractional US sized drill bits, and a paper template. The Vice which I mounted on an alpine ski last year designates a drill bit size. I just convert the the metric size to thousandths of an inch and use a fraction of an inch size. My smaller drill bits step up by the 64th of an inch which is .016 “. That has been close enough for me. As for not drilling too deep, I either eyeball the bit to the sidewalk, or use adjustable square to set a depth along the sidewalk. I then make a shoulder stop of electrical tape. I usually try not to bump the should, but I have in the past. I have used waterproof Titebond and urethane glues in the past, as well as epoxy. I have not had failures to date on either alpine or Telemark mounts.
I usually have a couple beers in the process as well. I figured I would add that because everything else I do is counter to best practices. I put in long hours every week to earn my salary ensuring all best practices are maintained. When I’m on my own time, I’ll do it my way. My methods are thought out and mechanically sound in the hands of a skilled mechanic. I stand by results. However, I’m only honestly stating what I do. The best course is always to follow best practices, unless you’re confident with an alternative method.



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phoenix
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Re: Vice mounting without jig

Post by phoenix » Wed Jan 29, 2020 8:01 pm

Fisheater has provided a good description of what to do if you use a conventional bit.
One fine point is that it's generally accepted that a slight countering on the top she helps avoid the "volcano" effect: tightening the screws pulls up on the top sheet. Dedicated ski bits will often have the countersink built in; when using standard bits, there are separate countersink bits available, if you choose to use them. The possibility also exists then of OVER countersinking, and weakening the screw hold... tread lightly.



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fisheater
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Re: Vice mounting without jig

Post by fisheater » Thu Jan 30, 2020 6:52 pm

Phoenix, that was great advice about a volcano on the topsheet, however I have googled Tognar’s site for their stepped bit. I then drilled with two different bits and greatly different electrical tape shoulder depths. Years ago I did volcano a topsheet. I pulled the screw immediately, and planed the topsheet with a very sharp wood chisel. I can’t remember, but I wouldn’t be surprised if I decided to use epoxy to remount that binding. Stepped drill bits or two drill bits should definitely be used with metal under the topsheet.



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phoenix
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Re: Vice mounting without jig

Post by phoenix » Thu Jan 30, 2020 11:20 pm

...and tapping the top metal layer (and only enough to barely go thru it) is often recommended as well. Someplace like Tognar would have 'em.



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