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| Why do you support/oppose the Iraq invasion? |
| Support cause morally right thing to do. |
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4% |
[ 1 ] |
| Oppose cause morally wrong thing to do. |
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72% |
[ 18 ] |
| Support cause we need to protect our ass. |
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8% |
[ 2 ] |
| Oppose cause we're hanging our ass out. |
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16% |
[ 4 ] |
| Oppose cause costs too much money. |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
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| Total Votes : 25 |
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| Author |
Message |
Baaahb
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
Posts: 15753
Location: Ponderosa
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 Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:29 pm Post subject: Just curious poll on Iraq invasion |
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Lots of ways to oppose/support the war...I tried to boil them down to the essential five....just curious...please pick the most important reason for your position
The first two options deal with moral issues...global issues...a viewpoint that is not fundamentally based on personal interests.
The last three options concern more selfish reasons.
If you're an American and you don't think we should be putting our soldiers in the line of fire in Iraq, then option 4 is your baby.
If you're a Finn and you oppose the US invasion because it's creating dangerous instability in the world, then option 4 is also your baby.
I voted for option 3.
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seki
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 6385
Location: Gone
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Guess we'll be at war with someone for a long time to come if "we need to protect our ass" by use of force. |
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otis of moab
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 5700
Location: Colorado Higher Country
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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I also voted for option 3.
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otis
Federal policy is dividing society between "those who work for a living and those who vote for a living".
-H.L. Mencken
All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusion is called a philosopher.
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JL
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 7749
Location: Salt Lake City
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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Iraq was not a threat.
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lemon boy
Joined: 21 Dec 2004
Posts: 2706
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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where's the option for oppose b/c it was totally unnecessary? 
or the option for oppose b/c we should've dealt completely and thouroughly with Afghanistan before moving onto other things?
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otis of moab
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 5700
Location: Colorado Higher Country
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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| JL wrote: | | Iraq was not a threat. |
That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. But the decision makers at the time did not have the benefit of 20/20 hindsight and there are those who still feel they were a threat.
I tend to agree with your comment but also benefit by looking through that rear view mirror.
Frankly, I think military action in the Middle East is necessary. I'm just not sure Iraq s/h/b the number one priority
_________________
otis
Federal policy is dividing society between "those who work for a living and those who vote for a living".
-H.L. Mencken
All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusion is called a philosopher.
-Ambrose Bierce |
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keithermadness
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 24795
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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Saddam was our boy...when it suited us.
Saddam did questionable and heinous things. We stepped down to his level when we did questionable and heinous things.
Much of what is currently going on over there was predicted without the use of rearview mirrors. Historians and scholars sed we were about to step into a quagmire....seems they were right.
Fact: We set up the environment to have 6,000 civilians killed in two months.
Bad Karma.
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"Everyday is a potential avalanche day."
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otis of moab
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 5700
Location: Colorado Higher Country
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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| keithermadness wrote: |
Much of what is currently going on over there was predicted without the use of rearview mirrors. Historians and scholars sed we were about to step into a quagmire....seems they were right.
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My bold to your post.
| Quote: | prediction
preˇdicˇtion [ prə díkshən ] (plural preˇdicˇtions)
noun
Definition:
1. statement about future: a statement of what somebody thinks will happen in the future
2. act of predicting: the making of a statement or forming of an opinion about what will happen in the future |
And if the predicting parties opinions had been wrong? Those people weren't elected to make the tough decisions. Leaders can and do make mistakes; it goes with the territory. Unelected "leaders" aren't accountable to anybody and have the luxury of being able to be wrong w/o consequence.
I could say "even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in awhile".
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otis
Federal policy is dividing society between "those who work for a living and those who vote for a living".
-H.L. Mencken
All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusion is called a philosopher.
-Ambrose Bierce |
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Baaahb
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
Posts: 15753
Location: Ponderosa
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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| lemon boy wrote: | | where's the option for oppose b/c it was totally unnecessary? |
I think that would be the 'morally wrong' option.
| lemon boy wrote: |
or the option for oppose b/c we should've dealt completely and thouroughly with Afghanistan before moving onto other things?
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I think that would be the 'shouldn't hang our ass out' option.
x25
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keithermadness
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 24795
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| otis of moab wrote: | | keithermadness wrote: |
Much of what is currently going on over there was predicted without the use of rearview mirrors. Historians and scholars sed we were about to step into a quagmire....seems they were right.
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My bold to your post.
| Quote: | prediction
preˇdicˇtion [ prə díkshən ] (plural preˇdicˇtions)
noun
Definition:
1. statement about future: a statement of what somebody thinks will happen in the future
2. act of predicting: the making of a statement or forming of an opinion about what will happen in the future |
And if the predicting parties opinions had been wrong? Those people weren't elected to make the tough decisions. Leaders can and do make mistakes; it goes with the territory. Unelected "leaders" aren't accountable to anybody and have the luxury of being able to be wrong w/o consequence.
I could say "even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in awhile". |
AND THE ELECTED ONES OWE IT TO THEIR CONSTITUENCY TO LISTEN!
And the talk is cheap when ya don't have ta walk it
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~km
"Everyday is a potential avalanche day."
-Missiongravity |
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JustinB
Joined: 07 Dec 2004
Posts: 4974
Location: Hol(y)land, MI
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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I usually try to stay out of this typical rehash of the same old feces but came across an interesting opinion from my wife's cousin. He has spent the last year & a half helping train the Iraqi police force. The majority of this time spent in Tikrit.
Here's my understanding of what he said.
- Saddam was weak with Syria & Iran on either side ready & able to pounce. (Pre and Post Invasion)
- This action keeps Iran & Syria at bay until Iraq can come close to holding them off until help arrives again. (implying we night get to a position of whtdrawal.)
- The trouble on the ground does not come from the inhabitants, but outsiders coming in.
My additional $.02
- Saddam made a convenient example to our "Friends" in the middle east who support terrorism.
- Saddam made a convenient example to our enemies in the middle east who support terrorism.
- Our EU & Far East allies could not go without Iraq's oil (Should Iran, Syria or both attack)
- For the "Get out now" folks - the US is still in Germany 60 years after WW-II & Guantonamo 100+ Years after the Spanish American War. One should never have been fooled in the 1st place to any thing other than a long term commitment on some level.
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French For Cant Tele
Joined: 02 Feb 2006
Posts: 5123
Location: Mammoth Lakes (sometimes)
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| JustinB wrote: | I usually try to stay out of this typical rehash of the same old feces but came across an interesting opinion from my wife's cousin. He has spent the last year & a half helping train the Iraqi police force. The majority of this time spent in Tikrit.
Here's my understanding of what he said.
- Saddam was weak with Syria & Iran on either side ready & able to pounce. (Pre and Post Invasion)
- This action keeps Iran & Syria at bay until Iraq can come close to holding them off until help arrives again. (implying we night get to a position of whtdrawal.)
- The trouble on the ground does not come from the inhabitants, but outsiders coming in.
My additional $.02
- Saddam made a convenient example to our "Friends" in the middle east who support terrorism.
- Saddam made a convenient example to our enemies in the middle east who support terrorism.
- Our EU & Far East allies could not go without Iraq's oil (Should Iran, Syria or both attack)
- For the "Get out now" folks - the US is still in Germany 60 years after WW-II & Guantonamo 100+ Years after the Spanish American War. One should never have been fooled in the 1st place to any thing other than a long term commitment on some level. |
Boy, and the results have been great. No more terrorism, what a relief. |
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otis of moab
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 5700
Location: Colorado Higher Country
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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| French For Cant Tele wrote: | | Boy, and the results have been great. No more terrorism, what a relief. |
No wonder you and like thinkers are so difficult to please. If your goal is no more terrorism, you'll never be satisfied. It ain't going away no matter what you do. But if you do nothing, you may be praying to allah before it's all over. 
_________________
otis
Federal policy is dividing society between "those who work for a living and those who vote for a living".
-H.L. Mencken
All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusion is called a philosopher.
-Ambrose Bierce |
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French For Cant Tele
Joined: 02 Feb 2006
Posts: 5123
Location: Mammoth Lakes (sometimes)
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| otis of moab wrote: | | French For Cant Tele wrote: | | Boy, and the results have been great. No more terrorism, what a relief. |
No wonder you and like thinkers are so difficult to please. If your goal is no more terrorism, you'll never be satisfied. It ain't going away no matter what you do. But if you do nothing, you may be praying to allah before it's all over. |
My point is that my whatever measure things are getting worse. No matter how much of an appologist for the Bush admin you are. |
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Baaahb
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
Posts: 15753
Location: Ponderosa
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| Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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FFCT, you dream of easy solutions to very difficult problems.
And there are measures that point to success. US fatalities for one. Number of factions supporting the new Iraq government, for two.
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