Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:36 pm Post subject: Compression Test Question
Tremper, on page 153 (Staying Alive In Avalanche Terrain) seems to suggest with each series of taps, one should increase the force of the tap. That is, with the 10 from the wrist, the 10th tap should be with more force than the 1st, and the same with the taps from the elbow, and shoulder.
Others say use the same force with taps 1-10, only increasing power when changing wrist-elbow-shoulder. I've been doing it this way.
I am fresh out of an Avy course (3 weeks ago). From what I remember each tap is supposed to be with the same amount of force. The amount of force is NOT supposed to increase with each tap.
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 2435 Location: Whistler, BC
Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:31 pm Post subject:
frail 1
Assume the quote you're referring to is "Now tap on the shovel blade with your hand, tapping progressively harder until the column fails..."
The next sentence he notes "don't push your arm into the snow, but let it fall with its own weight."
Then he notes that you need to learn how to communicate this to others (do you have a heavy arm, etc.?)... in relative terms.
This is the same in both editions...
What Tremper is referring to, in terms of progressively harder, is the difference between wrist taps, elbow taps, and full arm taps. That is the progression.
The 10 taps from the wrist will be the same effort; the 10 from the elbow will be the same effort, etc.
Assume the quote you're referring to is "Now tap on the shovel blade with your hand, tapping progressively harder until the column fails..."
The next sentence he notes "don't push your arm into the snow, but let it fall with its own weight."
Then he notes that you need to learn how to communicate this to others (do you have a heavy arm, etc.?)... in relative terms.
This is the same in both editions...
What Tremper is referring to, in terms of progressively harder, is the difference between wrist taps, elbow taps, and full arm taps. That is the progression.
The 10 taps from the wrist will be the same effort; the 10 from the elbow will be the same effort, etc.
Hope that clarifies things...
Thanks. However, he also writes "...perhaps the column failed on an easy tap from the elbow, or it failed on a moderate tap from the elbow..." further down the paragraph. Is this a typo? Is the first 'elbow' supposed to say 'wrist' in this sentance?
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 2435 Location: Whistler, BC
Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:06 am Post subject:
frail 1, I think that is a typo which was also reproduced in the second edition.
I don't think you'll find another reference to graded taps within each 10 sequence from wrist, then elbow, then shoulder in any of the literature; in fact, good reading. I hadn't noticed that in Tremper's book before...
Perhaps there's another school of thought, but all of my Canadian training was equal taps for each group of 10.
Here's an old article, which is still fairly clear on the methodology...
Note page 73, column two, near the bottom: "Using our practise of 10 taps perforce level...", for example.
See the following article for a more recent treatment of the compression test. This is very clear that there is no graduated increase in force within a 10 tap sequence from wrist, for example.
frail 1, I think that is a typo which was also reproduced in the second edition.
I don't think you'll find another reference to graded taps within each 10 sequence from wrist, then elbow, then shoulder in any of the literature; in fact, good reading. I hadn't noticed that in Tremper's book before...
Perhaps there's another school of thought, but all of my Canadian training was equal taps for each group of 10.
Here's an old article, which is still fairly clear on the methodology...
Note page 73, column two, near the bottom: "Using our practise of 10 taps perforce level...", for example.
See the following article for a more recent treatment of the compression test. This is very clear that there is no graduated increase in force within a 10 tap sequence from wrist, for example.
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