Joined: 21 Sep 2007 Posts: 17775 Location: EL/R -6.12, SL/A -8.15 in NW VT and slightly south of the Poutine Curtain
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:21 pm Post subject:
Mitch wrote:
slamdance wrote:
stevesliva wrote:
slamdance wrote:
You think I actually read it? Hahahahahahaha!
Too busy chasing me over into the happy forum, eh?
Dude, there are people with no arms and no legs, serving out life sentences with absolutely no chance of parole - that are too busy to read your links.
You are a piece of work.
Listen up though, stay the hell off the 'happy forum' or slamdance is gonna join fhw on the beach. By now you should know that dragging your grievances with each other upstairs, out of this den of iniquity and into the main party, does not work out very well for any of us.
I'm asking you to not cross that line and thanking you in advance for your cooperation.
and can you convince Ron to join us down here where he belongs? _________________
Joined: 06 Dec 2004 Posts: 7137 Location: Breckenridge CO
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:57 pm Post subject:
rsireland3 wrote:
Wow. It has been almost six months and Laura is back! Way to represent Laura!
Laura comes up with the best interwebz photoshopped images. _________________ Creeds and doctrines are like a raft to get you to the other shore and then to relinquish. Neither cling to the raft or reject it when drowning. Even better, become a strong swimmer.
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 6542 Location: Behind the wheel
Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:49 pm Post subject:
“I’m so tired and weary of trying to practice sane, passionate, good medicine in this insane health care system in the United States,” Paris said last month in an interview at Union Station before walking over to protest in front of the Supreme Court against the Obama health care law and for single payer. “It impairs my ability to practice in a way that is ethical and passionate. I have a few years left in me to practice. And I’ve decided see what it is like in another country. I have a couple of friends who are psychiatrists who have done a sabbatical in New Zealand. And they said they are so sad to be back in the United States practicing because it was so much more sane and caring in New Zealand. I’m going to see what it is like for my own mental health. ”
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 6542 Location: Behind the wheel
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 5:27 pm Post subject:
"The debate surrounding the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act illustrates the impoverishment of our political life. Here is a law that had its origin in the right-wing Heritage Foundation, was first put into practice in 2006 in Massachusetts by then-Gov. Mitt Romney and was solidified into federal law after corporate lobbyists wrote legislation with more than 2,000 pages. It is a law that forces American citizens to buy a deeply defective product from private insurance companies. It is a law that is the equivalent of the bank bailout bill—some $447 billion in subsidies for insurance interests alone—for the pharmaceutical and insurance industries. It is a law that is unconstitutional. And it is a law by which President Barack Obama, and his corporate backers, extinguished the possibilities of both the public option and Medicare for all Americans. There is no substantial difference between Obamacare and Romneycare. There is no substantial difference between Obama and Romney. They are abject servants of the corporate state. And if you vote for one you vote for the other."
"The debate surrounding the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act illustrates the impoverishment of our political life. Here is a law that had its origin in the right-wing Heritage Foundation, was first put into practice in 2006 in Massachusetts by then-Gov. Mitt Romney and was solidified into federal law after corporate lobbyists wrote legislation with more than 2,000 pages. It is a law that forces American citizens to buy a deeply defective product from private insurance companies. It is a law that is the equivalent of the bank bailout bill—some $447 billion in subsidies for insurance interests alone—for the pharmaceutical and insurance industries. It is a law that is unconstitutional. And it is a law by which President Barack Obama, and his corporate backers, extinguished the possibilities of both the public option and Medicare for all Americans. There is no substantial difference between Obamacare and Romneycare. There is no substantial difference between Obama and Romney. They are abject servants of the corporate state. And if you vote for one you vote for the other."
yup, true dat! And as bad as it is its a hell of a lot better than what we had 3 years ago!
What the whole thing illustrates is how pathetically ignorant and gullible the public is. Obama is a socialist, a communist, a govt run healthcare system. Do these people know how to read? I think the GOP govt id to vote idea along with a drivers test is a great idea and would backfire on them as these people can't possibly be capable of getting a drivers license.
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 6542 Location: Behind the wheel
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:05 am Post subject:
miked wrote:
yup, true dat! And as bad as it is its a hell of a lot better than what we had 3 years ago!
Can't you read?
Quote:
"It is a law that forces American citizens to buy a deeply defective product from private insurance companies."
How the fuck can that be better? At least before you weren't forced to purchase, and as the case in Mass., some peeps lost their homes on account of being forced to purchase Romneycare. _________________ DUCKBILLS FOREVER!
"Always remember, a cat looks down on man, a dog looks up to man, but a pig will look man right in the eye and see his equal."
yup, true dat! And as bad as it is its a hell of a lot better than what we had 3 years ago!
Can't you read?
Quote:
"It is a law that forces American citizens to buy a deeply defective product from private insurance companies."
How the copulate can that be better? At least before you weren't forced to purchase, and as the case in Mass., some peeps lost their homes on account of being forced to purchase Romneycare.
You're playing word games but ill play along for now...
"some peeps lost their homes on account of being forced to purchase Romneycare."
"some"? How many? How many compared to health care bankruptcies from no insurance? I said better not perfect.
"forced" to buy a product? You're god damn right, copulate yeah, everyone uses health care everyone pays for health care, why shouldn't everyone have to buy health insurance??????? Why should I have to pay for your health care you public funds sucking cheap copulate? Do you have a job? Buy your own god damn health health care or go out into the woods and die when you;re not feeling well, dont show up at the publicly funded emergency room. Duchebag!
The Massachusetts legislature, more than three years ago, passed what then governor Mitt Romney called "universal health care," a bill requiring state residents to carry health insurance if they can afford it and, if not, pay more in state income tax.
Companies with more than ten employees must provide a "fair and reasonable contribution" to the premium of health insurance for employees, or face penalties, with the employer getting to decide what the words "fair" and "reasonable" mean.
Utilizing a market connector concept in which people price shop from a buffet of private insurance companies, the Massachusetts measure is similar to one currently under consideration in the nation’s capital.
As Massachusetts may be seen as the paradigm for the health care overhaul Congress is now contemplating, it might be useful to take a quick look at some of the changes that have occurred in that state since the measure was passed in 2006.
While the foreclosure rate in 2007, nationwide, was nearly 80% higher than it was in 2006, foreclosures just outside of Boston "nearly tripled from January through September compared with the same period" in 2006, according to Boston.com. Hundreds of tenants in foreclosed buildings were evicted, or faced eviction by mortgage companies with the greates concentration of foreclosures in lower income neighborhood. In a state with an historically expensive housing market, area home auctions hit the roof.
When forced, by state law, to buy auto insurance, faced with unwieldy rent, and the escalating cost of food, the mandate to acquire health insurance may be seen as a strong contributing factor to the sharp rise in homelessness in that state.
Granted, Massachusetts is not among the top five states when it comes to foreclosure, and mortgage default, but what was an evolutionary trend nationally produced a dramatic, sudden spike in the New England state.
And, importantly, two years after its legislature approved what a former Republican governor likes to call universal health care, the Boston Globe reported the number of homeless people in Massachusetts had reached an all-time high. The demands on the mortgage payer to pay for make their auto insurance premium, pay off their credit cards, feed and clothe their family was only exacerbated by the additional demand of having to allocate a portion of their salary for mandated health coverage.
What’s more, ironically, a plan that was designed to reduce the number of people turning to hospital emergency rooms instead drove people into homeless shelters, and hotels. When considering that the official unemployment rate in Massachusetts is at 8.9%, below the national average, one can only imagine the havoc a national mandate to carry health insurance will wreak on the rest of the nation.
Reportedly, too, the Romney health care overhaul, in Massachusetts, has increased rather than decreased the overcrowding in hospital emergency rooms.
So, while Massachusetts may now brag that 99% of its residents have some kind of health insurance, it would be prudent for members of Congress, and the president, to take a long, hard look at the state’s housing market, and ask — at what expense?
With an unemployment rate that is expected to grow over in the foreseeable future, this is not the time to demand that Americans help shoulder some of the government’s burden in covering the uninsured by mandating that they carry health insurance. It’s essential to be perfectly clear, now more than ever, that there is a difference between universal health care, and mandated health coverage.
Reform that includes a mandate is reform in name only, and may ultimately prove to accomplish little more than to drive people from hospital emergency rooms into homeless shelters.
JAYNE LYN STAHL is a widely published poet, essayist, playwright, and screenwriter, member of PEN American Center, and PEN USA. _________________ DUCKBILLS FOREVER!
"Always remember, a cat looks down on man, a dog looks up to man, but a pig will look man right in the eye and see his equal."
yup, true dat! And as bad as it is its a hell of a lot better than what we had 3 years ago!
Can't you read?
Quote:
"It is a law that forces American citizens to buy a deeply defective product from private insurance companies."
How the copulate can that be better? At least before you weren't forced to purchase, and as the case in Mass., some peeps lost their homes on account of being forced to purchase Romneycare.
You're playing word games but ill play along for now...
"some peeps lost their homes on account of being forced to purchase Romneycare."
"some"? How many? How many compared to health care bankruptcies from no insurance? I said better not perfect.
"forced" to buy a product? You're god damn right, copulate yeah, everyone uses health care everyone pays for health care, why shouldn't everyone have to buy health insurance??????? Why should I have to pay for your health care you public funds sucking cheap copulate? Do you have a job? Buy your own god damn health health care or go out into the woods and die when you;re not feeling well, dont show up at the publicly funded emergency room. Duchebag!
OT gold! Stupid. Misinformed. Inarticulate and angry. He's all yours fuckers!
Twopass cites a "Poet, playwright and screenwriter" who gives us this little gem:
Quote:
When forced, by state law, to buy auto insurance, faced with unwieldy rent, and the escalating cost of food, the mandate to acquire health insurance may be seen as a strong contributing factor to the sharp rise in homelessness in that state.
That's some rock solid analysis right there!
Artists need to be reminded now and again where exactly they reside on the food chain. When they try to wrap their foggy, confused and muddled brains around real world problems they always end up overreaching and sounding like the angst-ridden, petulant little adolescents that they'll always be.
Joined: 07 Jan 2005 Posts: 15772 Location: Ponderosa
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 1:35 pm Post subject:
twopass, is that the best you can come up with to dump on Romneycare...that the additional cost of health insurance is driving people to the poorhouse, piggybacking its arguments on the nationwide housing crisis? that, btw, is far less severe in Mass than in Florida, California or Arizona?
that's weak sauce. very weak sauce. makes one want to give up spaghetti dinners altogether _________________ Other vegetables have a hard time competing with potatoes.
Joined: 11 Dec 2004 Posts: 937 Location: Putney, Vermont
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:22 pm Post subject:
twopass wrote:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
December 24, 2009
The Mandate and Massachusetts Reform in Name Only
by JAYNE LYN STAHL
...
What a superb analysis! The mortage crisis was caused by health care reform! Who would have guessed?
It'll be interesting if the SCOTUS invalidates the individual mandate - they'll basically be saying that it is OK to use a service without paying for it. What else can we stop paying for? I'd love to stop paying the politicians' salaries and expenses. However, they get paid with taxes (which are constitutional), so we may not be able to avoid them.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
December 24, 2009
The Mandate and Massachusetts Reform in Name Only
by JAYNE LYN STAHL
...
What a superb analysis! The mortage crisis was caused by health care reform! Who would have guessed?
It'll be interesting if the SCOTUS invalidates the individual mandate - they'll basically be saying that it is OK to use a service without paying for it. What else can we stop paying for? I'd love to stop paying the politicians' salaries and expenses. However, they get paid with taxes (which are constitutional), so we may not be able to avoid them.
Not to mention the article is about two and a half years old. Yeah buying health insurance is a financial burden no doubt about it. The fact of the matter is that its less of a burden with obamacare because the costs are spread out among healthy and unhealthy people. The fact of the matter is that Obamacare is better, cheaper, and more fair than the current system. You keep pointing out its faults but you're not comparing it to anything. This is not norway we're talking about this is the U.S.A., we're a very large country (the third most populated in the world) with a majority of low-middle class and few super wealthy inhabitants. I dont think we'll ever have universal health care like the wealthier countries do. We'll always have medical bankruptcies and people dying because they cant get the care they need, those are facts of life.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
December 24, 2009
The Mandate and Massachusetts Reform in Name Only
by JAYNE LYN STAHL
...
What a superb analysis! The mortage crisis was caused by health care reform! Who would have guessed?
It'll be interesting if the SCOTUS invalidates the individual mandate - they'll basically be saying that it is OK to use a service without paying for it. What else can we stop paying for? I'd love to stop paying the politicians' salaries and expenses. However, they get paid with taxes (which are constitutional), so we may not be able to avoid them.
Not to mention the article is about two and a half years old. Yeah buying health insurance is a financial burden no doubt about it. The fact of the matter is that its less of a burden with obamacare because the costs are spread out among healthy and unhealthy people. The fact of the matter is that Obamacare is better, cheaper, and more fair than the current system. You keep pointing out its faults but you're not comparing it to anything. This is not norway we're talking about this is the U.S.A., we're a very large country (the third most populated in the world) with a majority of low-middle class and few super wealthy inhabitants. I dont think we'll ever have universal health care like the wealthier countries do. We'll always have medical bankruptcies and people dying because they cant get the care they need, those are facts of life.
Every post is better than the last! Do it again!!!!
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 Posts: 17775 Location: EL/R -6.12, SL/A -8.15 in NW VT and slightly south of the Poutine Curtain
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:47 pm Post subject:
Bruce H wrote:
twopass wrote:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
December 24, 2009
The Mandate and Massachusetts Reform in Name Only
by JAYNE LYN STAHL
...
What a superb analysis! The mortage crisis was caused by health care reform! Who would have guessed?
It'll be interesting if the SCOTUS invalidates the individual mandate - they'll basically be saying that it is OK to use a service without paying for it. What else can we stop paying for? I'd love to stop paying the politicians' salaries and expenses. However, they get paid with taxes (which are constitutional), so we may not be able to avoid them.
I'd love to stop paying for the CIA to run drugs. _________________
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