[jarlybart]

[tOMfLOUNDER]

Reasoning for Onyx purchase over Dynafit, Fritche or other AT bindings:

My decision to go with the G3 Onyx was based on reading multiple reports on the existing bindings available after considering their strengths and weaknesses. My previous AT binding was the latest model Naxo 01 which had good reliability, a smooth tour, easy switching between modes, but was heavy and had a "static" or sudden release,(as opposed to a forgiving or elastic release that might recenter like the better alpine bindings will); this last trait led to prereleases.

I skied the Fritche freeride and to me it felt just like the Naxo 01,(with the "torque plate modification"/stiffener in place). Not bad, but I could feel the binding flexing in some situations and the extra hight off the ski compared to regular alpine bindings. I hated the tour, especially on lower angles. Another drawback was the potential for the binding ripping out during a "kneefall",(an awkward moment during touring that results in falling forward, the boot impacts the ski before the knee without the ability to release allowing for the possibility of levering the binding out of the ski). For those considering the Fritche, please note that there have been several improvements made with the "Eagle" model that may address some of these issues.

I have not skied any of the Dynafit bindings. Based on what others have said or written, they are not up to being skied as a "one rig" binding. If you wish to read more on them check in Lou Dawson's blog "wildsnow.com".

I am a fan of the tech binding concept and was intrigued enough by the Onyx to sign up for the beta program as stated in earlier entries. I believe the Onyx has several advanteges over the Dynafit, though they come with compromise.

Advantages: Using mounting plates, the Onyx has a much greater amount of adjustment and can be switched from one ski to another and so is a large savings in terms of cost. In the case of a binding failure, the binding could be changed out quickly & easily,(this is one reason I'm working on convincing all the other skiers on my SAR team to go with the G3). While many have poo pooed the ability to easily switch back and forth between modes without stepping out, I've personally found it to be helpful in several sketchy situations. A nice "elastic" release; I've been sking the Onyx as a one rig binding without seeing a downside or feeling that I'm compromising when resort sking, (I weigh about 155#, don't huck but ski pretty hard at times-I think-crash & burns are not real rare ). It skies really great. Tech bindings make your boot feel like it's bonded to the ski. This is something you have to feel for yourself before you can really appreciate it.

Disadvantages: Weight, particularly when the brakes are used is getting close, (6 oz.?), to the Fritche and significantly more when compared to Dynafit bindings. This is the first year in production for the Onyx and there are some issues popping up, (it appears G3 is aggressively addressing the predominant ones and I hope they will continue to refine their binding just as Fritche and Dynafit have been doing). Long term durability is not certain.

In summary, there is no reason you should care too much what I or any of the cult like Dynafit followers think. Make up your own mind, I did .

All the best, tOM

[Carbo]

Thanks Tom, great answer.

I spoke with the local G3 rep this weekend and asked him the same question. His answer was mostly about the spring-return-force during release. I don't know how much I care about this, really only one way to find out. DIN release is important to me....the quality of that release....??

I didn't know about the mounting plates, that's big for me. One of the big bonuses of 7TM for me is that mounting up a new pair of skis cost ~$90...instead of $250-400, huge savings when you have a quiver.

The ability to switch modes without removing the ski I did know about, and is also very important to me. I've gotten used to never having to take my skis off on a multi-lap day, and I really like it! Thanks for the reminder.

As for the ability to ski "all terrain" with one binding. I have no worries that a Dynafit could take everything I'd ever throw at it. I'm not a gear breaker, so any added burliness of the Onyx may be wasted on me, and just be a weight penalty....which is one of the main reasons I'm even considering locking my heals down.

Pushes&7tms Tours are freakin HEAVY!

[Carbo]

Lou Dawson has a comparison blog poast up:
http://www.wildsnow.com/2714/onyx-dynafit-comparo

unlike me, Lou doesn't care if you can re-skin while keeping your skis on.....

[J]

The convenience is enormous.

But many love the fiddle factor of gear, maybe a quick break, hell, there are people out there that don't mind hiking with another 2-8lbs of bindings and skis tham me?!?
_________
I'm needing to replace some rusty Dynafits soon. With earlier models and Garmonts I could rotate out to change to hike mode with my poles. My newer Dynas and Scarpa boots don't like that transition at all.
My replacements will be Onyxs for the plate and transition advantages.

[jarlybart]

if you have not seen how the crampons work yet here is a quick video we made. Got them for a guy who was leaving the next day so no on-snow video but still you will get the idea...super cool!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nj_1nbehJcc
_________________
Ski bum Dad and owner of Yeti Social/Marketing Director for Ski Oregon!

[jarlybart]

A couple close-up pics for your viewing enjoyment




_________________
Ski bum Dad and owner of Yeti Social/Marketing Director for Ski Oregon!

[J]

I very much like my many Dynas but the G3s look so much more refined.

Except for the wire thingy! Looks to be a weak link but maybe not the stressed part.

I've a spring-time hill where crampons are helpful. But most slopes work well without them.

[tOMfLOUNDER]

After a lot more days at both the resort & in the bc I can report the following:

Since getting the production G3 Onyx binding, I have not experienced any pre-releases, "insta-tele's", or failures. The binding continues to perform well. I have not had the heel lifters dislodged or lost as has been reported to be an issue for others, though this could be a concern.

Sometime ago I reported that my onyx bindings had seemed to develop some play in the toe jaws along their axles/pins. I measured the play as accurately as I could with a dial indicator and have checked it again after many more days of skiing. The amount of movement has increased by more than double. I have been in touch with G3 concerning this issue. They have asked me to send the bindings in for a warranty replacement, which I will do. I would be happier if they could tell me why this is happening and that they had a remedy. I can see no signs of fatigue or indications of impending doom, but clearly something is changing that should not be. Even so, the binding continues to ski well.

Another quirk that has popped up has to do with the ability to move the binding from one ski to another. The two screws that hold the toe piece securly to their base plate have started to hang up on the edge of the plastic toe piece so they are hard to remove,(or completely clear the threaded holes of the base plate). The toe piece can not come off even if the screws are loose until the screws are clear of the holes in the base plate. At this point I need to slide the blade of my swiss knife in from the side to pry up on the screws to free the toe piece from the base plate. Not a hugh deal, but not working as advertised or as it did when new.

I've now put somewhere near a dozen days on some lightwieght spring skis I mounted with well used Dynafit "speed" bindings. Since I got them dialed in they've done fine and I feel the're the ideal in light wieght,however; from my experience, the onyx is much more user friendly to get into, switch modes, change heel lifts and has superior retention. Bottom line; the dyna's are stayin', but I'm keepin' the onyx on all the rest of my quiver.

There has been a long silence from G3 concerning the complaints from consumers,(go to their website & read customer reviews for yourself). I hope they will find the fixes & make good for all. I believe they're well on their way to a great binding.

All the best, tOM

[whitefang]

If anyone can post details pictures or info on how G3 has improved the lower heel lift attachment on the latest version (2010-11) of the Onyx binding, I'd appreciate seeing and learning about this. I've got two pairs of older Onyx bindings with not a lot of action on them, but nonetheless have managed to lose the lower heel lifter on 3 separate occasions, recovering the missing piece only once and having to track down replacements for the other losses. This is my biggest disappointment in the Onyx to date and I'm hoping the improvement that G3 was planning in instituting are in fact solid fixes. Next question is how to retrofit older bindings to prevent further loss?

[dm]

total rip-off of Dynafit - buy Dynafit to support the company that actually created the technology. It will make you cooler.
Looks like totaly unnecessary "housing" material surrounding the guts of a Dynafit. Lame.

While I'm spouting off - K2 skis are made in China. Shoes from China - OK, skis - NFW. That is all...

[whitefang]

DM, competition is healthy, monopolies are not. We should all encourage innovation and new product development or risk stagnation and decline of our sport. Choosing to boycott China is OK if that supports your personal philosophy of the world, but others who consider themselves citizens of the world in a global economy are focused on other more important efforts like job growth and product innovation at home (wherever home is). I have no problems supporting a Canadian company like G3 or other foreign companies if they build and design good products. What goes around comes around eventually. Build liaisons and support structures that tie the world together, not that tear us apart and we will all benefit from that.
Peace, happy holidays and first tracks to all.

[dirtbag]

I have about a dozen days on my Onyx:

Pros:

- Easy to switch from ski to tour mode.

- Base plates available for multiple skis.

Cons:

- Heavier than Dfits.

- The tall climbing bar fell off and got lost.

- It does take a constant pressure to keep the front jaws open. If on unstable surface, I can just hold them open with my fingers. Not a deal breaker.

- - I experienced the dreaded insta-tele as reported by others. It happend just after skiing an icy, steep, no-fall zone ( I even locked the toes because I didn't want to release.) Scared the bejeesus out of me. This IS a deal breaker since it could've resulted in a serious crash. I'll be sending mine back.

[tOMfLOUNDER]

Interestingly enough it seems that insta tele's only seem to happen if/once the climbing heel lifter falls off,(since it's designed to protect the mode lever. My understanding is that the 2011 onyx has different hardware and heel lifters that should solve the problems; furthermore, there is a kit available to upgrade the 2010 with the same hardware & lifters as the 2011. My feelings are there should have been a recall or free upgrades since it seems to be an obvious design flaw. I've yet to upgrade mine.

On a side note, while I've not lost any heel lifters and never suffered an insta tele, (since I got the production binders), I've been suffering insta tele's with my dynafit ft10's when using my Scarpa F3's, but none with the G3 onyx. I've been cranking up the vert release on the ft's and all 155#'s of me are now skiin' near the max setting . I'm wondering if there's additional leverage on the vert. release because of the bellows? But why am I only getting this type of prerelease with my dynafits & not the g3's???

The mystery continues, tOM

[dirtbag]